Patron spends $175.000 in two days on 2 local artists.
13 March 2008
42 CommentsTwo unnamed local artists split $175.000 dollars after New York investment banker goes on a buying binge.
Last year the buyer spent over $78.000 dollars in one day.
He says that he may have found hidden treasure.
The artists refuse to sell their art in the local market because of a very nasty downturn in the local art prices
The buyer plans on putting some of the work up for auction in the upcoming year.
Excuse me while I check the wire…(clickity,clack,clickity,clack)
This just in… Bullshit.
No really, congratulations to these unnamed artists. It just goes to show how under valued the art and artists are here in Jacksonville. I would also like to congratulate the New York Investment Banker on his ability to sniff out the hidden treasure within Jacksonville.
Okay, cool, there’s a patron. But why the covert operation? Why is this so hush-hush?
What press is this story from? It’s really making me scratch my head.
Sniff, sniff …. eww.
who were the artists. who is local in new york right now making money?
big time. didn’t know there were art patrons here in Jax myself. I’ve heard of such rare species but have yet to site one in person.
Just in time! There’s a patron event at the MOCA tonight at 7pm. It’s called Public Trust : Private Treasures and if this isn’t where we can bump elbows with would-be buyers in Jacksonville, I don’t know where we could.
I’m confused Lee. Is that 175,000 or 175.00. The old decimal in front of the three zeros throws me for a loop.
If Lee is reluctant to tell you who the artists are, its a good bet he cashed in on part of it.
I know he’s been talking about New York for a couple of weeks.
It would be nice if Art news were covered with and substance in this town, but I guess thats why this blog is in existence.
And people, seriously, 175k for two artists work? so about 90k a peice?
Thats NOT a large amount, especially for corporate purchases, and depending on the number of canvasses not much at all.
In some of the charity art auctions with splendidly mundane living room and couch peices locally, I have watched Tom Bush (to name one local patron) spend forty to fifty thousand at a single sitting on only a couple of peices.
And thats locally.
and btw, check out the chinese art market recently.
if you want to know where the real money is being spent its china. On art at least.
The post stated 175.000 dollars and realistically that’s not a number that I’m aware of.
I thought this entry was more like an Onion entry. A play on numbers and a play on words. It made me laugh.
lol
and btw, there are tons of patrons, as well as art buyers in jacksonville.
First off, Byron It was a typo.
It was $175,000.
The buyer lives in New York, buys Southern art,came here for two days and left.
He’s very particular
He will not buy anything for less than $5000,00 dollars, which excludes most local artists.
He normally buys in the $20,000 dollar range.
Morrisson, If you can figure out who gets that amount of money for their paintings, you can help Kelly, uncover the Patron mystery.
Muffin, Its all sooooo covert, because, its business.
In twenty years, after the upcoming Economic Depression, when all of you have had that many years as an artist under your belt, if your that unlucky.
$175,000 ameros will be what you pay for a cup of coffee.
As far as the Bullshit posts, I’m not sure why anyone on here would say that.
Unless, maybe they are poor and afraid of money.
Even the Chinese are smarter than that now.
Maybe you are in the wrong country, maybe you should be living somewhere other than America.
Maybe Russia.
I’ll buy your ticket, first class.
Thanks Lee for the update. Your first post on here is about how much money someone is making off their art in Jacksonville just to rub it in our faces? What’s that all about?
I’d appreciate it if you’d not come to this site and try and belittle us young artists who aren’t making any money with our artwork.
If you want to be part of JaxCAL fine but don’t talk down to us or me. I’d appreciate it. And a typo is something that is usually done once, not three times in a row, so that’s exactly why I thought it was a play on numbers of which I thought was rather funny. And in your reply I feel you are just being snarky and pretentious of which I’d rather not have anything to do with.
I think the community here in large isn’t making any money with their artwork and to sort of just throw it in our faces that some artist who is most likely not any better than any of the artists on this blog but has some connection with a banker in New York is making a shit ton, I’d rather not hear about. And I truly think the likelihood of any investment banker spending that much money on any artist right now (regardless of where they are from) is highly unlikely with today’s economy going down the tubes. Sorry to be short sited about all the money folks are making in the art world but I make art for other reasons than the money or I’d be done a long time ago. If you are the artist who made all that money, congratulations.
But like most of society agrees upon, how much money you are making is not polite to talk about. And I think that’s the same here on JaxCAL especially with artists who are busting their asses, trying to provide for their families, trying to build community, and trying to find time to make art.
Also, congratulations you have been an artist so long. Maybe instead of belittling us you could help grow the community through mentorship. Just an idea.
wow
im actually getting ready to post a Lee Harvey Interview, and Im a little surprised at this last post.
I dont think Lee is trying to belittle anyone with his post, just trying to make some connections in people’s heads about money, patrons, and art sales, which has been a longstanding and recurrent bitch on this board.
I think its saying something about our art scene that we immediately think its bullshit.
Whatever else you might have to say about Lee, Byron, he and Tom Hager (one of the other fairly successful artists in town) and a whole lot of other young rabble rousing artists got their start when local artists couldn’t even get a gallery show.
They had to organize shows out on the streets of five points just to get their work shown, and most of them didnt have the money to make stands to show their work.
Tom Hager wrapped his photos in saran wrap and used clothespins in order to get his work up high enough that it could be seen.
Lee sold his work for between 150 and 1200 a canvass until he learned the art market.
Hager was even less.
Because of Lee’s censorship fight over his gallery, I think sometimes Lee takes it for granted that people already know that hes an artist who truly came from the street, and that his sale prices have made the gap over time from about a hundred dollars to about 10-20 thousand over just a few years. Hopefully its a skill that can be learned by every talented artist in the city.
Lee also opened up the first gallery devoted to new young artists is Riverside and gave a number of people their first shows and start in art shows.
I think that his only reason for posting on here at all is to help out other people, so it was probably a little shocking to get called a liar on his first post.
And I hope that you arent serious about not talking about sales and the business side of art on this site.
I was only replying to Lee’s post. I have no animosity towards anyone, especially Lee.
Reread his last comment and tell me again if you don’t feel it’s belittling Stephen. I disagree. But tone can never be conveyed through the internet. I’m sure many relationships have been broken over this fault in e-communication.
I’m happy for anyone who’s figured out how to make a living as an artist. Congrats. I’d love to figure that out myself and if anyone would like to offer insight on that I’d be happy to listen and would be a loyal student.
I look forward to Lee’s interview also and would be happy to help you post it if ya need help with it.
Lee you are more than welcome here man. I really just thought your post was a joke because of the typo. sincerely.
Art of acquisition
Local collectors follow their hearts when they decide which pieces to buy
By Charlie Patton
Times-Union staff writer
Whether you are looking to add another masterpiece to your museum-quality collection or just looking for something to hang over your living room couch, experts say there is one simple rule for collecting art: Buy what you like.
“Buy what appeals to you,” said Jacksonville collector Preston Haskell, named as one of the top 100 private collectors in America by Art & Antiques Magazine. (Jacksonville collector Sam Vickers also was on that list.)
“Don’t buy for financial reasons,” Haskell said. “Don’t buy for prestige. Personal enjoyment has to be the highest objective.”
Haskell’s other rule, which most experts agree with, is to develop a reasonably coherent philosophy — pick a style and stick with it.
His collection, for instance, is built around the work of the Abstract Expressionists. Vickers’ collection consists primarily of Florida landscapes.
Tom McCleery and Gunnel Humphreys, owners of the Edge City boutique in Five Points, built their collection by buying the work of friends. After 25 years of collecting, many of the artists who were unknown kids when McCleery and Humphreys started buying their work have built major reputations, meaning that pieces McCleery bought for a few hundred dollars may now be worth thousands.
“I like to help young artists who are just getting started. If I buy their art, I can nurture their careers as well as acquiring really nice pieces.”
McCleery and Humphreys buy works created by their friends and other young artists just starting out in their careers. They hold a painting by Christian Pierre; behind is a painting by Jonathan Lux. Both are local artists.
– Bob Self/staff
But McCleery said he has never sold a piece. He’s given some away and “retired” others to storage. But for him, art was never an investment.
“I buy art because I love living with it,” he said. “Also, I like to help young artists who are just getting started. If I buy their art, I can nurture their careers as well as acquiring really nice pieces.”
He still remembers his first purchase, made in 1973. He had just moved into the 4,000-square-foot apartment in Riverside where he still lives and he decided to buy a signed Salvador Dali print from Reddi-Arts, the San Marco gallery.
“I paid $350, which was a major commitment at that time,” he said. “But I liked it. And I wanted to have something on the wall. Maybe that’s why everyone starts, because you want to have something you enjoy living with.”
From that beginning, the collection slowly grew. “Gunnel and I had a lot of friends who were artists, like Pete Petersen and Oscar Senn,” McCleery said. “We bought their work to help them along.”
Buying pieces for as little $50, they acquired a collection of hundreds of pieces. His latest purchase: A piece by young Jacksonville artist Jonathan Lux.
Haskell took almost the opposite approach. The first piece of art he bought, back in the mid-1960s, was an abstract by Jacksonville artist John McIver.
But he soon began looking for pieces by artists with national reputations. When Haskell built a new home in 1978 and a new office building in the early 1980s, his collecting became accelerated, as both the house and the headquarters building were planned with large abstract works of art in mind.
In building his collection, he used the services of Jacksonville art consultant Jackie Holmes. “A consultant can help you negotiate prices and can guide you to the right sources,” Haskell said. “Eventually, you get a certain amount of experience of your own, both financial and artistic.” Haskell said he remains on the lookout for new works to add to his collection. “I visit galleries whenever I go to major cities,” he said. “I’ll go through 40 or 50 auction catalogs a year. … Ask any collector and they’ll tell you a collection is never complete. Part of the joy of collecting is in the acquiring. Then there’s the pleasure of having the art around you.”
Haskell said that collecting local art is a good way for a young person to get started. He doesn’t collect the works of local artists, but said there are several whose work he admires, particularly Ashton Hinrichs.
When Hinrichs is not working on her own art — she currently has a show at the Karpeles Manuscript Library Museum — she works as an art consultant. One of her clients is John Rude, chairman of The Vestcor Cos. Rude said he became interested in collecting art through his friendship with Haskell and Vickers, both of whom encouraged him to find a particular area of specialization.
After flirting with the idea of collecting California Impressionist art, Rude said he decided to build a contemporary collection that would support local artists.
After buying several of Hinrichs’ pieces, he hired her to help him find local art. “I just don’t have enough time,” he said. “So I rely on her to find things.” Finding a price range you’ll be comfortable with is an important first step, Rude said. His purchases have ranged from $750 to $16,000, with the average price around $5,000. “What we buy is not what I call expensive,” he said.
Haskell said he considers $5,000 the minimum price for a really good piece of art. But collectors don’t necessarily have to spend a lot to acquire pieces they like. Jacksonville artist Lee Harvey said he hasn’t paid more than $600 for anything in his extensive and valuable collection of local art. Harvey, whose own pieces can sell for as much as $8,000, often trades art with fellow artists.
Bartering is one way that many young professionals can begin building collections of local art. “Artists are the easiest people in the world to trade with,” said Jacksonville artist Jim Draper, a partner in Pedestrian Inc. Pedestrian operated a gallery in Riverside and will be a partner in the new Spiller Vincenty Gallery near the Southbank.
Most artists, especially young, emerging artists, are eager to sell and willing to help make a sale happen, Draper said. “If you are smart about it, you can have a piece that will last you a lifetime. That’s the true investment, if you have something you are going to enjoy for 60 years.”
“We were surprised at how reasonable some of the art was,” said Tom Moore, a general contractor who, with his wife, Kathy, has spent the past two years acquiring about 50 pieces from such local artists as Tony Rodrigues, Liz Burns, Steve Williams, Oscar Senn, Larry Wilson, Laurie Hitzig, Jay Shoots, Linda Broadfoot and Draper.
“There are a lot of artists in this area,” said George Kinghorn, education director and curator of the Jacksonville Museum of Modern Art. “This is a wonderful place to start a collection.” Some people are “intimidated in a gallery environment” or unsure if it’s appropriate to approach an artist about buying his or her art, Kinghorn said. And some young artists exacerbate that problem by acting reluctant to sell. “For some reason, they think the work is sacred,” he said.
“But all experienced artists are looking to sell,” Kinghorn said. “The seasoned artists are very accessible when you ask them. Very often, they will work out some kind of agreement.”
“Some people think galleries are very snooty places and a few of them in New York are that way,” said Maarten van de Guchte, executive director of the Cummer Museum of Art & Gardens. “But I’ve found that most commercial art galleries are very helpful. You are a potential client.”
Several experts, including Haskell, Hinrichs and Kinghorn, emphasized hand-pulled prints, signed and numbered by the artist, as an affordable way to begin collecting any artist’s work.
Finally, if you want to be a serious collector of art, you have to be willing to make an occasional mistake, said Patti Verbanas, editor of Art & Antiques Magazine. “Every collector I know has horror stories about the one that got away, the one they didn’t buy because they weren’t sure and now they wish they had,” she said. “If you have the money, just take a chance and get it. You might not have another opportunity.
“If you’ve followed the rule that you never buy anything unless you like it, you’re not going to make a true mistake anyway.”
there is much to say about the rambling going on here, i have been selling as long as the contemporaries mentioned and prices go up and down it is really the content of the work that should matter most. lee does have connections and i have known him to protect his patrons as if they were his own child. it is a small market we have chosen to be a part of, that is why everyone should leave town with their art and make new realities for themselves, see what the rest of the art world is doing. challenge your own creativity. there is much humor in what is said on our beloved jaxcal, it is a online diary of many…
great points morrison!
btw, here is the article link to the story I just posted…it lists a few of the local collectors.
http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/060301/dss_6339176.html
Lee I want more than anything for everyone to work together. I know that’s almost a utopian ideal but really I’m all for it.
Sorry if my reply seemed hurtful. I really think all of this is good for the community. Any type of communication. I mean it should be WIDE open for folks to disagree, get upset, love each other, hate each other, and all of that.
Talk about a real art market and how to establish one here again is definitely something that needs to happen if we all aren’t to leave Jacksonville which Morrison said might be our only option. Unfortunately not all of us can leave. And I’m really just trying to make the best of it while I’m here in Jax, and here on planet earth.
Nice article Stephen. Unfortunately that was written in 2001. I wonder how an article of that nature would fair today?
I hate how tone can not be conveyed in this type of communication.
Look forward to reading your interview.
Have a great weekend everyone. We’re meeting at Uncommon Grounds in San Marco now for the Saturday meetings at 10am. Hope everyone can attend.
bk
2001, was the year of the spiller vincenty debacle.
so much of the networking between patrons and painters has disappeared since then.
more lee! more lee! wee want more lee!
Thanks Byron,
Battling a very rare and deadly form of cancer has taken up most my time after coming back from New York in 2005.
I have tried to be more involved with the arts, like in the past.
Buying local art has been a passion.
Even before I began to make art, I was buying art.
Opening up a local gallery with my own money was proof of that.
When I chose to comment about some good news concerning local artists
making money, the last thing I expect is to be called a lair.
Maybe thats the tone of the times.
When I started making art in 1991, there was a very similar tone.
In 1996 I was threatened with arrest for showing Pete Peterson’s nude Adam and Eve paintings in my gallery, in Five Points of all places.
My daughter who is fourteen now, was then two.
Very serious times indeed.
I fought the city, their lawyers and the vice squad for a year to protect yours and every other artists right to do what you do.
If you don’t beleive me ask the local artists that came before me.
Yes, this is about more than making money.
But, how does one pay their bills, raise a child, open a gallery in Five Points, buy art and survive without money.
I know most people on this blog are young enough to be my kids, me being born in 1961.
These may be bad times, but do you remember the 1970’s or 80’s or 1991.
I do.
Gold was once $35 dollars an ounce in the 70’s, now it is $1000 ounce.
BTW, Gold is still a bargain.
Artists in Jacksonville as a whole make less now than the artist in the 70’s.
How do we change that?
Byron, this blog will be the local artists voice.
But first we must get rid of the self-doubt, name calling and Folio- like tactics.
… zzzzzzz ….
ah…..hipsters who are unimpressed.
They are always so cool. I think I can still remember the names of the ones from 10 years ago.
I think so anyways.
i have learned a thing or two from Mr. Harvey that’s fer shur!!
So glad you are feeling better brother!
most definitely.
I’ve learned a thing or two from Mr. Creegan also.
Any ideas on how to get the art market back that existed in 2001?
really wish we’d get back to the concepting and solution making that this blog started out with.
dude believe it or not, its about making lists of people.
we should get together in person and talk about how to organize a show. making guest lists is totally the most important thing…believe it or not.
then its about throwing an event and learning the lead time you need in order to make people show up.
I suggest we get together and chat.
Cool Stephen. Let’s work on an event and in getting a list together. I’m all ears.
We’re meeting every Saturday at 10am at Uncommon Ground in San Marco.
Everyone is welcome to come.
Thanks Mark,
Can you imagine if we had blogs when we started making art, how much better the art scene would be now.
They have no idea the bullshit we have had to put up with.
BTW, after seeing your show last week, I commented in the upcoming interview with Steven that you are the most important artist in Jax.
Hands down!
I would love to place the toothpaste wall in one of my clients homes.
That would be amazing.
Isnt’ it all relative and connected Lee?
I’d say we are all important because we all impact each other. Like a mosquito batting it’s wings in India affecting Mark’s toothpaste piece.
Even artists just starting out have something to offer to this whole mad world we live in. An artist who has one year under their belt can help change the world and make others think. It shouldn’t matter if you are 80 or 18.
Just my take on it.
Mark, what the hell are you doing?
Why are so many people finally noticing the quality of your work.
I must make time to see it, because Its been a long time to see for me.
Byron, Jesus made us all unique and perfect and every soul is worth saving, at least to a priest but not every soul is worth paying for.
In my mind art must be the same way.
We are all important, no doubt, but I think that art has to be worked at.
I ended up going to the collector’s event at the MOCA last night. There were about 50 people in the audience, half of them 45+ and half of them younger. Many seemed to be “real” collectors…a few artists in the crowd…and there of course were some younger business blokes who wanted to learn how to make a quick buck.
The main idea behind every panel member’s strategy: buy the art that you love (within a structured framework or theme if possible), not the art you think is going to make you money.
Same idea as the 2001 article.
Another theme was that these top collectors tend to go through dealers, gallerists, and auctions for the most part for their acquisitions. They do occasionally go through artists themselves, but trust a relationship with someone they know to pick out potential pieces that they’re going to love (see The main idea, above).
I spoke with Margaret Gellatly personally after the event was over and had a chance to ask which places specifically she and her husband shop at here in Jax: Steller’s and J Johnson. Other than that, they have kids and don’t get to go out much in search of art or to art openings. Again, they rely on their contacts to bring potential pieces to them.
Of course, these are serious collectors, not just people who want to buy art. These are people who want to build a collection that potentially will hold key names in contemporary art that they could then pass on to a Museum as a donation. With this in mind, one strategy is to find artists who are local but have already started to prove themselves amongst the sea of some 30,000+ BA and MA graduates each new year with out-of-town shows (specifically New York); they want to find the names that will last. (But back to The main idea, it must also be art that they love. And once they become better at understanding the art they are looking at, they naturally will choose better art, because the better art is the art that will last.)
http://www.target.com/Arrangement-Black-James-McNeil-Whistler/dp/B000BHPYPS/sr=1-1/qid=1205529644/ref=sr_1_1/602-4022048-4431859?ie=UTF8&pricerange=&index=target&field-browse=1038576&rank=-price&rh=k%3Aart&page=2
Btw, here is what I always say to local artists who say that Jackonville people wont buy art. Click on the link to find out.
I used to think so too Stephen but recently have had the pleasure of getting to know Kelly Pope from DA. A senior at DA and think that her concepts are as strong as someone twenty years her elder, so I’m not thinking folks have to do it forever in order to make important work.
anyways. cheers…
Well they say Mozart was composing sonatas at age six. Byron.
What a great, thoughtful post Bird Brain.
I had just promised my girlfriend that I would not comment on this subject again.
Then birdbrain made the perfect point about the original post.
So there are 50 people there?
Yikes, not good.
Maybe thirty are “collectors”?
Sixteen, were yuppie-scum?
And I mean that in the best way possible.
Go real estate!
And four are artists?
Thats New York Giants Superbowl odds.
Go Giants, fifty to one, baby!
Byron, this is not perfect math, I’m making a point here.
Guess who was there?
You were there, my dear.
You are what art dealers and collectors look for.
because?
You want to know the rules.
Good for you, my dear
If I can ever help you, feel free to ask.
Let’s just hope I don’t go out like Mozart, eh?
Rachel, your comment was great. Will you be at Uncommon tomorrow?
certainly not with his hair, I should hope, Kelly.
Actually Kelly, I’m sitting at Uncommon grounds as I type! Waiting to see your (and everyone else’s) smiling faces walk through the door.
Thanks for the comments about my comment about the post. I learned a lot about collectors (and collecting) from that event, and YES I was going to find out what “The Rules” are! It’s my typical sneak attack…
So I read back through my notes and another thing I wanted to pass along was something that one of the panelists said, though I don’t remember now which one. They said that when they look to buy art, they look for some sort of maturity level, whether it’s in technique or content. In other words, if it looks like it could have been made by a 2nd grader, but only a 2nd grader who comprehends Heidegger, then it’s likely eligible as an acquisition candidate. Were it of a gumball machine, well, sounds like the group of works may have to be able to say something as a whole conceptually.
Also, Margaret, who curates the Airport galleries, says that many times she receives submissions from artists but their art just doesn’t fit for the theme of the show. She encourages people to submit again! And again! Not only does that keep your artwork fresh in the minds of the curators, but with it there, you could pop up in their minds when they’re talking to other curators who need pieces for a show that they’re doing.
Okay, just one more thing, and again I regret that I don’t remember who said it, but it was brought up that lots of times these collectors will buy local art as gifts for friends, relatives, etc, in hopes to spread their love for art and to support local communities and artists. It seems to me that one probably wouldn’t send the more challenging content to their grandmother, but you never know who knows a collector who collects XYZ topic artworks.
That’s encouraging, as far as local buyers go. Sorry I didn’t go to the meeting this morning. I needed sleep desperately, as well as time for my Chuck Close project (it’s due Monday!).
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The alter ego of contemporary art.Chief Contributors Include:
Mark Creegan / Morrison Pierce / James Greene / Akbar Lightning / MonKevtheModern / Byron King (Founder)
A sounding board for developing contemporary art and culture founded in Jacksonville, Florida.